As part of Len Brown’s announcements yesterday on his vision to increase public transport patronage to 150 million trips a year by 2021, there was quite a lot said about improving the ferry network. Here’s what was included in this article from Stuff in terms of improvements proposed to the ferry system:
His plan for ferries is an ambitious one. He would like to see services running to Hobsonville in the west, Upper Harbour, Mairangi Bay, Takapuna in the North and Beachlands-Maraetai in the East.
Currently ferries run to Devonport, Waiheke Island, Rangitoto Island, Bayswater, Birkenhead, Stanley Bay, Motutapu and Northcote Point.
He said places such as Half Moon Bay, Stanley Point and Bayswater all needed major upgrades to keep up with the growing demand.
”I am very focussed on ferry usage. We are the City of Sails. We are a city that has got three harbours and two great coastlines and so much of our city is built around those waterways. And we shut down those ferries to a large extent when we put the harbour bridge across, but I want us to genuinely lift our ferry use.
”If you are a shoreite and you are going up and down Lake Rd every morning, you don’t want to face that, so we have got to provide the alternatives.”
That’s not actually an exhaustive list of current ferry routes. Ferries also operate to West Harbour, Gulf Harbour and Pine Harbour (perhaps having “harbour” in the name of the place helps?) Furthermore, plans have long been in place to operate a Hobsonville ferry – once Hobsonville Point starts developing over the next year or two. That could quite easily link into a Beach Haven service, which has also previously been mentioned. This would leave Takapuna and Mairangi Bay as the two “truly new” services proposed. This is shown below: red being existing routes, green those in planning already and blue being routes not previously planned for:
The obvious strength of ferries is that they operate completely independently of the road network, so therefore are excellent at reducing congestion. Secondly, they can often link areas together in a far shor terdistance than would otherwise be possible: Devonport to the city being the classic example, but also probably Half Moon Bay to the city (and between Hobsonville and Beach Haven in the future). The weakness of ferries is that they tend to be very “point to point” – offering very limited catchments unless they are well supported by feeder buses or other connecting services. Because they are, by necessity, on the coast, generally the catchment of ferry terminals is further reduced.
I guess to cut a long-story short, perhaps the best thing you could do to improve the ferry system is actually focus on what happens on land – improving the feeder bus system. Include ferries in the integrated ticketing system (I keep hearing vicious rumours they will be left out), get the feeder buses providing convenient and well time connections to the ferries and ‘open up’ their catchments to something much larger.
I also think the merits of a Takapuna ferry service might be rather doubtful. The trip by bus seems a lot shorter.
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While the ferry network isn’t as small as some make out, what are the frequencies? if they are only every hour or even every half an hour it isn’t much use to people in the same way that infrequent trains or buses aren’t much use unless that is when you want to travel. We propably need a decent fleet of perhaps smaller but more efficient boats that we can run at least every 15 minutes to/from each destination
The Devonport ferry runs approximately every 15-30 mins throughout the day and is probably the most popular of the ferries, perhaps also because Devonport is a destination in itself unlike the Upper Harbour ferries which only cater for commuters and don’t run at all during the off peak AFAIK. I do think increased frequencies and better feeder services could really benefit patronage of ferries from the Eastern parts of Auckland.
Wouldn’t ferries from Mairangi Bay and Takapuna pretty much duplicate the busway services that already exist? Except for the small number of people who would be able to walk to the ferry terminal, the rest who would have to take a feeder bus might as well feed themselves to the busway as to a ferry. This is even more the case when you consider that Auckland will have rail to the Shore within the next ten years or so. Why spend years building ferries and ferry terminals (which will need breakwaters and other civil engineering works) when rail isn’t far away?
Brisbane has ferries, and they’re great for getting across the river. The busiest day of the week is – SUNDAY!
It is a real tourist attractor- doubles as both public transport and a scenic river cruise, which is why they are so popular. Services run every 15 minutes and there are buses that stop at the terminals or nearby.
Auckland would be more comparable to Sydney with regards to ferries. http://www.sydneyferries.info/wharves-and-maps.htm
I have colleagues who catch the West Harbour ferry, and it stops stupidly early. The last ferry during the week is somewhere around 19:30, which is just pathetic. It’s useless if you’re having a late evening at work or in town.
If it’s true the ferries are being left out of Hop, that needs some serious sunlight directed its way. That any operator, never mind an entire mode, won’t be included is completely unacceptable and threatens the long-term validity and acceptance of the system.
One of the best ways to get the ferry system improved (in addition to what was already mentioned – more frequencies and better feeders) is also pretty expensive: buy better ferries.
I think we should get the fastest off-the-shelf ones we can get (mindful that they need to be designed so that wake doesn’t destroy our beaches or seawalls – a classic problem with fast ferries). And I think they should also investigate automatic docking – ferries take so LONG to berth, it can be embarassing.
This all looks great, but let’s make what already exists useable first, eh? The West Harbour ferry (which departs just around the corner from my house) is a great service from an area which has terrible public transport. Unfortunatly, it costs $12 each way (or $89 for a ten-trip). Why would you spend $17.80 a day on a ferry, when parking in the city is $7? It’s hardly surprising that patronage is so low, is it?
Indeed. The fares are exorbitant. Even Devonport is $5 each way casually, and let’s not get into Waiheke.
Wow, that sounds like extortion.
Sydney ferries, for travel over 9 km is about the same though ($13.20 is the cost of 2 single tickets).
Not sure what distances your ferries go. This is why cross-subsidy is important- it keeps prices down
to something reasonable!
Auckland Ferry Building to Devonport is swimming distance, were it not for being a busy shipping lane (and you wouldn’t want to swim in that water anyway!). Straight-line distance is somewhere less than 3km – hell, it’s less than 20km to take the long way up Beach Road from the Ferry Building to the motorway and go across the Habour Bridge!
ohhhhh!!!! Ferries!!!!
Ferries would be a bit more than “point to point” if we built a proper ferry service. A glance at the map shows how “watery” Auckland actually is, if an effort was made to dredge and dig the inlets and estuaries. As far as I can tell, there is nowhere in the entire isthmus that is more than 4km from the sea, with the vast majority being a lot closer. I think the catchment area could be a lot bigger than you think.
With some enthusiastic spadework a ferry canal along the 1.5km from the Tamaki inlet to the Manakau Harbour would open up the whole of the Manakau, and could easily be bridged along Portage Road and Canal Reserve. In theory, this would allow a ferry to travel from the airport, Papakura, Kingseat, Drury, and Waiuku to Warkworth and all points in between )of course, it would require a bit of ongoing dredging can get ferries to Warkworth, Riverhead, Albany, New Lynn, and Otahuhu/Otara etc etc).
An efficient ferry service could, in Auckland, be almost as convenient as buses. The road costs nothing to maintain and most journeys are in sheltered water. The prevailing westerly winds of this country would make for a reliable service in exposed waters off the Eastern Bays – on all but 3-5 days a day the sea conditions would allow a sixteen knot Vaporetto-type vessel to operate safely. A wharf capable of handling four vessels could shift large numbers of people quite efficiently. An average speed of twelve knots (about 20km/h) would be fine for a ferry service, with “express” planing hulls capable of achieving 18-22 knots perhaps run at peak times for a higher fare.
I have long been of the view that the geography of the Auckland isthmus is quite unique in it’s opportunities to build a ferry service that is even greener than trains and could match them in passenger numbers.
Or, rather than joining the two harbours (I like the idea of boring a huge tunnel and putting in a massive tidal power generator), which would be very expensive to do and maintain, have ferries on the Manukau connecting to rail in Onehunga or Mangere Bridge. The estuary runs almost to the Onehunga train station, or a station in Mangere Bridge could be located near the harbour.
“Wouldn’t ferries from Mairangi Bay and Takapuna pretty much duplicate the busway services that already exist?” – Not really Constellation drive would be the closest busway station to Mairangi Bay shops and that’s about 3km away not really that close. However Mairangi bay is not the right place to have a ferry terminal in my opinion. The Mairangi Bay Village is tiny and not close to anything major. Browns Bay would be a better bet in my opinion it’s a bigger centre and beach. Likewise the Akoranga station is about a kilometere or so out of the centre of Taka, not really that convienient in my experience.
I think the Takapuna ferry would be goer because the area is home to a higher socio economic group. Many of these people would catch a ferry but wouldn’t be seen dead on a bus. I think would also be good for tourists or day trippers in a similar way that the Devonport one is.
Agree though that fares have to come down. Far to expensive at the moment
I used to live in Devonport and enjoyed the walk along the waterfront each day to from the ferry – wouldn’t have ever swapped that for riding the bus to town. Nothing beats being out on the harbour on a beautiful morning or evening, and being able to grab a coffee or sandwich on the way across is something that you can’t do on a bus. You also can’t take your bike on a bus. I think a lot of people, as Cam says, who wouldn’t take a bus would be happy to take a ferry from Takapuna to downtown. Much like trains, ferrys don’t have the stigma associated with buses. Even without good feeder buses the Devonport ferry has a large walk down catchment, and walking isn’t something to be feared! I’d often rather walk than have to schedule my day around feeder buses.
I don’t know how valid the whole “bus stigma” is on the North Shore anymore. After all the busway is pretty damn popular.
I think that generally most people don’t have a problem with buses, however, I do know of people who would rather drive than be stuck on a bus in traffic and you still have National ministers referring to them as loser cruiser on occassion. I do think that the ‘wealthy’ portion of society don’t see why they should catch a bus rather than drive into town in their car, and this is a view that isn’t so common in places like Germany IMO.
Interestingly, from a tiny sample size of two (my Aunt and my Dad) it seems that former car drivers are happy to use the busway but only if they can drive to the station and have their car waiting for them when they return. Both tell me they love the busway but think there needs to be much more parking. My aunt actually said, in perfect honesty: “how do they expect people to use the bus if there aren’t enough carparks?!”. When I suggested they catch the bus from right infront of their respective houses rather than parking, they looked at me like I was insane. Perhaps the idea of leaving the car at home completely was just too far out for a couple of National voting baby boomers!
Brisbane’s busways do not have parking at stations, except for at the very outermost stations (Eight Mile Plains). Most passengers never set foot at a busway station- they are picked up at street bus stops and enter
the busway system when the buses use ramps to enter the busway system (a similar thing can be done for running buses to trains).
There have been many calls for more parking at busway stations, but they have all been resisted by TransLink because, at least around our rail stations, the car park fills up so rapidly that people spill out into suburban streets. Of course, we don’t charge for parking, many places overseas do though. Context matters- Perth uses park and rides to gain ridership at their train stations.
The now completed new Birkenhead terminal looks like a ferry can now roll up to it (originating from Beachhaven/Hobsonville) and leave without any reversing or slow/tedious manoueveurs. Indeed, the ferry now does a 180 degree spin entering the terminal rather than doing a reversing manoueveur.
Northcote looks like it could do the same however for some reason citybound birkenhead ferries still spin around on approach here, doing a 360 degree circle by the wharf.
If they can get this right, a Hobsonville-Beachhaven-Birkenhead-Northcote run could do quite well and have good frequencies with several ferries servicing all stops.
WRT ticketing, the exclusion of ferries from integrated ticketing is just stupid, especially considering that they’re more integrated NOW than they will be under the new system! Currently, NZ Bus all-zones monthlies and Discovery day/monthly passes are valid for the Shore ferries.
I live in Birkenhead and work in the west so to able to cycle to Beachhaven and get the ferry to Hobsonville and on to work would be perfect. It would cut about 25kms each way I spend in the car, that is almost impossible to do any other way than the car. I am sure I wouldn’t be the only one this would be great for.
_Any_ public transport operation in the Auckland region who does not fully participate in integrated ticketing should be killed with fire. Get tough – we’ve compromised too far, far too long.
A good ferries, I was just prepping a post on this topic so I’ll just add it here.
The old Draft Ferry Strategy had an exhaustive examination of new routes, but unfortunately it is no longer available anywhere online so I’m going on memory here. It judged these on three basic criteria:
1) Walk catchment, potential for bus stops/turnarounds and availability of park and ride land
2) Feasibility of wharf construction and operations (i.e. length of wharf to deep water, prevailing weather conditions).
3) Equivalent travel time by car and land based public transport.
They started out with a huge list of potential locations like Sanctuary has noted, and excluded those that failed on one of the above factors. For example:
Pt Chevalier to the CBD would have taken twice as long by ferry than by bus. Bucklands Beach lacked sufficient catchment of any kind (due to Half Moon Bay being so close). St Helliers had little space for park-n-ride and would have required a wharf over 600m long to reach all-tide deep water. The requirement for super long wharves was likewise a problem with places like Mairangi, Murrays Bay, Mission Bay etc. Anything on the Manukau Harbour or upper Tamaki had limited catchment and slower trip times than by bus or car.
The routes that made the cut but with conditions were (again by memory):
-Te Atatu, but only if there was intensive development of the reserve area (could make a great ferry based ToD )
-Greenhithe, but only if the boatbuilders could relocate and the wharf be opened to public use and yard space used for parking and bus turnaround.
-Island Bay, but probably only as a stop on the Beach Haven run as while it already has a pontoon wharf ready to go the catchment and parking is too small to accommodate (a la Northcote Point on the Birkenhead run).
Three routes were considered very suitable, two of which got some progress:
-Hobsonville (Will kick in once development is progressed).
-Beach Haven (This was going ahead but was mothballed when the regional fuel tax was cut, apparently it has been deferred until 2013).
– Browns Bay via Takapuna.
This last one was very interesting and should be done ASAP in my opinion. The route was mothballed basically to not draw patronage away from the then unopened busway, which I suppose they were nervous wouldn’t be very well used. Obviously this is not a problem now.
The journey times were calculated at twenty minutes to Takapuna and thirty-five to Browns Bay, which is consistent with average speeds of about eighteen knots (which is relatively conservative). In both cases the ferry would therefore be faster than driving or busing at peak times, particularly because Browns Bay is quite far from the busway (4.3km to Constellation) while Takapuna has minimal benefit from the busway, and both are subject to much congestion.
At Takapuna the old wharf site by the boat ramps is still there and would only need a relatively cheap extension with pontoon. There is space for bus and parking on the reclamation (usually only used on weekends for boat trailers) and actually quite a few apartments nearby plus good walking links along the shoreline. It’s also at the end of Takapuna that is quite far from the bus station, and there is the Bruce Mason Theatre and a lot of bars and restaurants nearby.
At Browns Bay a longish wharf would be needed (approx 200m), plus some kind of breakwater. In my opinion an extension straight off the Inverness Rd pedestrian mall makes the most sense. Buses stop on Clyde Rd right by the mall, and there is a fair amont of parking along the beach.
One key thing about Takapuna and Browns Bay is that they would support both commuter traffic to the central city, and counter-flow traffic outward also. Takapuna has it’s own CBD with good job density, plus the beach, theatre, café scene and nightlife. Browns Bay has a small local buisiness district but cafes and shopping and a very nice beach and waterfront reserve. With a 35min ferry from town it could position itself as the ‘Mission Bay of the Shore’.
So in my opinion the priorities should be, in no particular order:
1) Hobsonville (once the development starts to open)
2) Browns Bay via Takapuna
3) Beach Haven via Island Bay
A fourth route I think should get some consideration is an upper harbour one calling at Greenhithe, Herald Island and Paremoremo. Alone each of these might not cut it on patronage, but on the water their existing wharves are only a few hundred metres apart so they could be pooled into one route. A large park and ride yard at Paremoremo could attract commuters from the large section of ‘lifestyle’ properties and small villages stretching from Riverhead to Coatsville and the Albany hill. Despite being only about12km from downtown as the crow flies, these areas have drives of 25km+ to get around the harbour and inlets.
Another possiblity would be a long run with multiple stops, say Paremoremo, Greenhithe, Herald Island, Hobsonville, Beach Haven and Island Bay. This would maximise the patronage on the one route, but probably at the expensive of trip time and directness. A straight run out to Paremoremo for example could take as little as 24 minutes, but if you add on three or four minutes for each stop on the way the run starts to take 45 minutes or so..
How far is Paremoremo township from the prison? Looking ahead to very expensive petrol, a regular ferry service could help prisoners at Pare maintain family connections – something that is considered very important to effective rehabilitation.
Given Pare’s location in Arse-end, Nowhere, for the majority of Auckland, quality public transport options could be the difference between frequent and infrequent (or non-existent) visits for prisoners.
Pare has a little hamlet directly opposite the prison, but most houses are spread across the wider area. There is almost nil opportunity for walk up catchment and probably minimal bus opportunities, so a sizable park n ride would be needed. According to StatsNZ there are about 5,000 people within a 6-7km drive of the existing (little, awkward to get to) ferry wharf. It would be the ferry equivalent of Albany busway station.
Firstly, Auckland is blessed that its geography creates a need for this third type of PT. Its great from both a commuting and tourist point of view – and looks grand out on the harbour.
Seems to me though – as others have said – the growth inhibitors are cost and frequency, and only then the need for new destinations like Hobsonville.
Lower capacity, faster ferries (meaning greater frequency) would seem the idea. Gradually rolled out from most popular route to the least. Perhaps some routes can even stay with the the more “classic” ferries given their lower demand.
Ultimately though, a review of the subsidy arrangement is required to get prices down – however that might be done.
One problem with lower capacity faster ferries is that you trade off capital cost for high operating costs. This would greatly increase the cost of providing the services, which in most cases would mean either very high fares or a huge subsidy bill.
For example, the small and fast litle ‘water taxi’ ferries that run out to Westpark can carry 30 passengers with one crew, while the Kea ferry used on the Devonport run can take 200 passengers with only two crew, so the staffing cost of the small boats is three to four times higher per passenger. If you run them more frequently, then the loadings could drop further making the cost per passenger even worse.
I think the answer is to have larger boats running relatively frequently (say 15 or 20 mins at peak, but to have each route service perhaps three or four wharves along the way, effectively using the same service model as a rail line.
If we look at Brisbane (http://www.brisbaneferries.com.au/pdf/NetworkMap.pdf) and Syndey (http://www.sydneyferries.info/uploads/library/timetables/FinalNetworkMap101010.pdf) we see they generally take this approach, apart from Sydneys very busy route to Manly and the cross-river punts in Brisbane.
Once usage across the ferry network grows, it would be interesting to see the appetite for an inner harbour “loop”.
It could service new, smaller, more basic wharves not currently serviced (lower demand meaning no need for elaborate wharf facilities or park and ride) while linking with 3-4 of the current more prominent destinations with direct routes to the CBD.
It could serve locals not wanting to go from one destination to the CBD and back but to other harbour destinations (e.g. travel from West Harbour to Devonport for the day, and when intersecting with the existing wharves, arriving/departing between CBD departure times, thereby increasing frequency at those wharves.
To supplement the potential lower usage, it could also prove to be quite a tourist drawcard – the chance to cruise the inner harbour and seeing, up close, the different suburbs and bays, much like the river ferries in Brisbane.
A possible route could be:
Queens Wharf
Pt Chevalier
Te Atatu Peninsula
West Harbour (to link with CBD direct ferries)
Chatswood
Northcote Point (to link with CBD direct ferries)
Devonport to (link with CBD direct ferries)
Mission bay/St Heliers
Back to Queens Wharf
All the stuff of dreams of course…..
I really like this meritous idea of yours KLK. I think it would be well used, and there’d be a lot of walk up traffic, and quite a lot of passengers using it and not getting out at Queens Wharf.
“This is why cross-subsidy is important”
Ferry subsidies are very low at the moment in Auckland, so I presume that is part of the high prices.
While I’d love to see ferries on the Manukau, where to and from would they go? Not enough development yet, and no direct destinations for work, except maybe the airport.
The Hobsonville Peninsula development has just begun to open – first houses being sold now and so on. So hopefully that service will start soon. Does anyone know whether the ferries will go via West Harbour, or directly? Admin’s map at the beginning seems to indicate the latter.
Some more, (but partly slightly out of date) info here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_transport_in_Auckland#Ferries
Manukau Harbour is accessible from a number of Waitakere locations, including Cornwallis. A ferry service that linked in, say, Laingholme, Cornwallis, Onehunga/Mangere Bridge and the airport could do quite well. At present if you live in the outer west it’s a looooong way to get south.
If it connected to the airport in a convenient location it could also be used for air passengers.
My map is not meant to show the exact routing. I thought Hobsonville was to be paired with a Beach Haven service, though I don’t think the money is available (thanks to our good friend Mr Joyce) to build the Beach Haven wharf infrastructure for a few more years.
More bus links to ferry ports, more wharfs for ferries to stop at on the route (think of a dredged channel to a wharf at Glendowie & St Heliers that the Half Moon Bay ferry stops at, or a wharf at Howick Beach that the Pine Harbour ferry stops at) And drop the prices a bit too, I mean it is EXPENSIVE!
It would be fantastic to open up the Takapuna business area with a ferry, especially if you could go directly from Half Moon bay to Takapuna, or even just to see a show at the Bruce Masson, a day at the beach, rather than spending all the time (and petrol) to go from East Auckland to the North Shore.
I’ve recently moved to Whangaparaoa and work in the CBD. The drive is not bad during the day, on a good run 30-40mins, but rush hour is a painful 1-1.5hrs and has been a nightmare 2 hrs on one journey. The drive starts with a never ending snake of traffic winding its way along the peninsula onto SH1 just past Silverdale and then the usual bumper to bumper crawl from Greville Road turnoff.
I tried the ferry for the first time last week and it was a very pleasant, stress free 50 mins from Gulf Harbour to CBD. And an even more stress free journey back in the evening with a much deserved refreshing beer in my hand, great!
The only problem is the usual 2 ferries a day each way! Not so great! In the morning leaving Gulf Harbour at 7am & 7.30am and in the evening from the CBD at 4.40pm and 5.35pm. There is an extra one during the day Weds – Sun. So not exactly geared to people starting or working a bit later in the CBD.
I’ve already complained to Auckland transport, who have said there isn’t the demand, because they’ve never had a full ferry! Clearly a very scientific way of judging potential demand! Talking to people in the area there seems to be a common belief that if there were more ferries, at more convenient times, residents would much prefer to use the ferries, rather than sit in the rolling car park of SH1. There is a lot of new development springing up in the area, which will only increase the traffic unless more ferries are added at more convenient times. Auckland Transport could create the demand by providing additional services and ensuring they were effectively marketed to the people along the Hibiscus Coast!
When I look at Beachlands where a few colleagues live, they have a very enviable 11 ferries each way plus an extra 2 late on a Friday to take those people home after enjoying a night out in Auckland – lucky them!
Does anybody know, how or what Auckland Transport will be doing to canvas and assess extra capacity across the ferry network?
I notice that plans by the BBay Business Assn for the Browns Bay “wharf” do not envisage a pier at all, rather they actually call for an extremely large carpark to be built in the northern section of Browns Bay itself, as well as a bus stop & bus turning area – they suggest that this will be achieved either by reclaiming land in the bay or building a concrete structure similiar to the industrial wharves in the CBD out over the water…from the “artist’s concept” drawings this monstrosity would cover most of the bay and beach area between the northern headland and the coastguard station! – no thank you….
How about Gulf Harbour to Takapuna? If there was such a service then living on the peninsula would make sense. Housing in Gulf Harbour is cheap as chips compared to the North Shore.
is there any one stillinteresting in pusuing ferries navigating the upper harbour if so please get in touch